fortunesfool
New member
Okay. Here we go.
Hi Shawn Classroom #1 for OSL... TAB
- Thread starter TAB Studio
- Start date
Shawn R. L.
New member
See if I can esplain this.............First I\'ll start with the blue and I think the same will apply to the orange.
You\'re going to have to get into two different mindsets.
first - the blue area......forget all the individual areas and different parts. View the blue area as A WHOLE - in a sense, one thins or space to be painted. Using a dark, transparent, vibrant blue wash over the whole area having the furthest away from the light being dark to almost black and getting thinner and thus lighter as it approaches the closest places to the light - the left side of the head, top of the ear, hair, left shoulder.
There is a second step (the other mindset) that I think I will leave for your next WIP.
Any area that isn\'t being lit by the flame or pipe, highlight and blend as normal with grey somewhere around 444. Go ahead and run this right up to the colored, lit areas and blend the grey into them. DO THIS STEP AFTER DOING THE ABOVE WASH.
The pipe glow - I\'m not talking here about tone (darkness or lightness) I\'m talking about literal distance. It shines too far. Using the same gray, do the highlighting described above but eliminate about half of what is now brown. Cut the distance in half.......and don\'t have there be and abrupt transition to the brown. Do a good blend from gray to brown.
I think I\'ll stop there and wait for your next WIP\'s.
PMS
http://www.theawristocrat.com/pantone.php
You\'re going to have to get into two different mindsets.
first - the blue area......forget all the individual areas and different parts. View the blue area as A WHOLE - in a sense, one thins or space to be painted. Using a dark, transparent, vibrant blue wash over the whole area having the furthest away from the light being dark to almost black and getting thinner and thus lighter as it approaches the closest places to the light - the left side of the head, top of the ear, hair, left shoulder.
There is a second step (the other mindset) that I think I will leave for your next WIP.
Any area that isn\'t being lit by the flame or pipe, highlight and blend as normal with grey somewhere around 444. Go ahead and run this right up to the colored, lit areas and blend the grey into them. DO THIS STEP AFTER DOING THE ABOVE WASH.
The pipe glow - I\'m not talking here about tone (darkness or lightness) I\'m talking about literal distance. It shines too far. Using the same gray, do the highlighting described above but eliminate about half of what is now brown. Cut the distance in half.......and don\'t have there be and abrupt transition to the brown. Do a good blend from gray to brown.
I think I\'ll stop there and wait for your next WIP\'s.
PMS
http://www.theawristocrat.com/pantone.php
Teflon Billy
New member
Shawn,
I didn\'t want to imply that I\'ve disregarded your advice for the warlock model I asked for help on. Its just that he has over 12 coats of paint on that leg near the sword and another 4+ coats of blended paint would hide all robe detail. All the lessons I\'ve learned on that model will have to be applied to any subsequent models: including your color suggestions.
Thank you, again, for continuing to support our OSL learning for several years.
I didn\'t want to imply that I\'ve disregarded your advice for the warlock model I asked for help on. Its just that he has over 12 coats of paint on that leg near the sword and another 4+ coats of blended paint would hide all robe detail. All the lessons I\'ve learned on that model will have to be applied to any subsequent models: including your color suggestions.
Thank you, again, for continuing to support our OSL learning for several years.
the catman
New member
im no expert but I would thin the paint on the pallette then wipe it of and only use a small amount.
the catman
the catman
Shawn R. L.
New member
Post a picture of what you come up with .
darklord
New member
ok so as some of you will know the iron painter theme this round is osl and i have done it once before. this is supposed to be denethor on the burning pyre but i have gone to far with the osl it seems. so shawn what would you recommend? is it a case of starting from scratch or is it save able?
green stuff
New member
Just my 2 cents : I think you\'ve got the colors down right but it\'s hard to see the difference between the fur on his coat and his chainmail. I\'d add some extra white spots coming from beneath on the mail.
fortunesfool
New member
Okay. I\'m about satisfied with this step (i.e. only a few fiddly details to tidy up like the gray on the fur coat). Was this what you were looking for?
I apologize for not having a straight on shot of brogar against a black background. My camera made it all fuzzy and unusable.
I apologize for not having a straight on shot of brogar against a black background. My camera made it all fuzzy and unusable.
fortunesfool
New member
After seeing how small, the white background panorama had been shrunken, I loaded a copy to Cmon. Here\'s the full blown pic.
TokenArtGuy
New member
@ fortunesfool -
I believe that Mr. Shawn was referring to the rate at which light degrades from the light source. I took the liberty of marking up your image for reference, I hope you don\'t mind.
[/img]
The brightest, most intense, point is at the center of the bullseye.
Hopefully this helps and I\'m not missing the point someplace... ???
I believe that Mr. Shawn was referring to the rate at which light degrades from the light source. I took the liberty of marking up your image for reference, I hope you don\'t mind.
The brightest, most intense, point is at the center of the bullseye.
Hopefully this helps and I\'m not missing the point someplace... ???
Shawn R. L.
New member
@darklord - Start over again? E-gads NO. What you have is real good. At this point, what you have is good and effective, the only thing I would recommend is to increase the darkness of the shadows that are going UP - away from the flame/light. Above the belt, the top of the shirt, the chin, between the upper lip and the nose, top of the cheek, the crevice where the robe meets the cloak. Show some shots of the back.
Shawn R. L.
New member
@ fortunesfool - Sorry to do this to you but I\'m having real trouble telling what is going on with the gray I recommended. In some of your pix it looks almost white and some of the others it looks almost black. It\'s supposed to be a MID range grey. If the problem is the camera I\'d say to try using a diffuser and sunlight - a piece of typing paper will do fine. Put your piece out in the sun, hold the paper about 6 inches above the fig and shoot. Have a plain background and try different settings to get a range of exposures and hopefully one will be close to what it really is.
The pipe and it\'s cast glow are looking good.
What TokenArtGuy posted is great. Thanks TAG.
The pipe and it\'s cast glow are looking good.
What TokenArtGuy posted is great. Thanks TAG.
Shawn R. L.
New member
@ darklord - I was zipping along and didn\'t even notice your second post.
To me, something changed between the two and I like the prior one much better. The color shift and tone shift are much more abrupt on the second one. The highlights on the bottom of the robe, the belt and especially the face are too far. When you do a real abrupt shift like that it will give the surface more of a metallic look. It works REALLY WELL on the knights. I would\'nt change a thing on them. Ask you to do two different things ( if you wish, it\'s ALL up to you). Revert the figure to the first post and do what I said above.
Also, is the pillar the lightsource?
To me, something changed between the two and I like the prior one much better. The color shift and tone shift are much more abrupt on the second one. The highlights on the bottom of the robe, the belt and especially the face are too far. When you do a real abrupt shift like that it will give the surface more of a metallic look. It works REALLY WELL on the knights. I would\'nt change a thing on them. Ask you to do two different things ( if you wish, it\'s ALL up to you). Revert the figure to the first post and do what I said above.
Also, is the pillar the lightsource?
darklord
New member
right another update here. been getting some good advice (which helps becasue i\'m learning this as we go along!!) wanted your opinion on a few things.
i have roughly marked out the base and where the highlights and shadows should be. the two knights shadows are correct as i used a real light source where denethor was and traced the shadows. i cant work out where denethors shadow would be though as obviously the light source is within the pyre so i cant use a real one for that. would he cast a shadow on the wall if he is abovve the source? i have also mapped out the shadows from the fire but i am unsure how wide the should go or how far (is there a way to work that out? the last thing (sorry for all the questions!!) is i have put where i think the stonework edges should be highlighted but wasnt certain particuarly in the centre of the wall as the edges would change from left to right,etc?
i know the photo suck but was a quick one and it is just for the shadow placement at this point
i have roughly marked out the base and where the highlights and shadows should be. the two knights shadows are correct as i used a real light source where denethor was and traced the shadows. i cant work out where denethors shadow would be though as obviously the light source is within the pyre so i cant use a real one for that. would he cast a shadow on the wall if he is abovve the source? i have also mapped out the shadows from the fire but i am unsure how wide the should go or how far (is there a way to work that out? the last thing (sorry for all the questions!!) is i have put where i think the stonework edges should be highlighted but wasnt certain particuarly in the centre of the wall as the edges would change from left to right,etc?
i know the photo suck but was a quick one and it is just for the shadow placement at this point
TokenArtGuy
New member
@ Shawn - You are welcome. I have to use my 733t graphic art skillz 
for something useful from every once and a while to prove their worth.
@ Darklord - First off your concept is great. I like the pyre better than the pillar. The model that you have picked is very difficult to light in the direction that you chose. I tried illustrating some ideas with your photo:
Hopefully this isn\'t too confusing. The bell shape of your model makes for it casting shadows onto most of the model (small image on side of photo). The wider base of the model should be blocking most of the light throwing the majority of the upper part of the model into shadow (sorry for the lame illustration of this, I hope it gets the point across).
Try taking a flashlight and holding it below your face and shining it upwards. This should give you a good idea how the face might look.
Continue the lighting effect on the floor and walls. Things that are not in the light source will be dark (such as the parts of the nights facing away. Shadows get wider as they travel away from the light source, they also get fuzzier. The real metal on the knights makes for a difficult read as the metal is reflecting highlights that do not match the in-scene light source.
Again, this is a great idea. I look forward to seeing what you do next with it.
for something useful from every once and a while to prove their worth. @ Darklord - First off your concept is great. I like the pyre better than the pillar. The model that you have picked is very difficult to light in the direction that you chose. I tried illustrating some ideas with your photo:
Hopefully this isn\'t too confusing. The bell shape of your model makes for it casting shadows onto most of the model (small image on side of photo). The wider base of the model should be blocking most of the light throwing the majority of the upper part of the model into shadow (sorry for the lame illustration of this, I hope it gets the point across).
Try taking a flashlight and holding it below your face and shining it upwards. This should give you a good idea how the face might look.
Continue the lighting effect on the floor and walls. Things that are not in the light source will be dark (such as the parts of the nights facing away. Shadows get wider as they travel away from the light source, they also get fuzzier. The real metal on the knights makes for a difficult read as the metal is reflecting highlights that do not match the in-scene light source.
Again, this is a great idea. I look forward to seeing what you do next with it.
darklord
New member
wow thanks tokenartguy, thats a real help. as this is my first osl attempt (apart from a little lava reflection on some moria goblins i\'m still finding difficulties along the way and the shadows were another. the photo isnt really a good one for the face as the light is all wrong. i was always going with a pyre so glad you like. one thing that has been pointed out is the brightness of the fire. even though each piece of wood has had osl on it (even those not showing) it is coming across to dull to project the light i have done. any thoughts?
TokenArtGuy
New member
Think of your light source as a bull’s-eye or target with your most brilliant color being the light itself. As the light travels from the source it will get darker. So white to yellow to red then fade to black. The intensity and size of the light source greatly affect the size of the bull’s-eye.
The bottom of the robe should be very, very bright. Like the fire itself, as parts of the model get further away go to orange then red, then purple. The areas in shadows should be black -or whatever mood color you are using, such as dark purple, green, red or whatever. This area is very dark, you could lightly highlight this area in order to give the model components definition. Don\'t paint the rest of the model as being lit from overhead!
Please refer to the dwarf cannon model earlier in this article, which is done really well by the way. Notice how everything not lit directly by the light source is very dark, this is because of the harsh lighting of the muzzle blast. Your scene is very similar, one intense light source. The back of the cannon is like your model on the pyre, there should probably be very little of the model being hit by light. Mr. Shawn\'s reference to imagining a paint bomb going off is a good analogy to figuring out where the light is going to hit.
One thing that you can do is take a similarly shaped model hold it upside down and shine a flashlight from above. You should be able to see where the light is hitting the model and use this as a guide. You might have to fudge some additional lighted areas on the model if there are too few in real life. This might help the model read better in this case.
Let me know if you need more illustrations to help clarify what I\'m talking about. I tend to ramble on a lot.
Good luck!
The bottom of the robe should be very, very bright. Like the fire itself, as parts of the model get further away go to orange then red, then purple. The areas in shadows should be black -or whatever mood color you are using, such as dark purple, green, red or whatever. This area is very dark, you could lightly highlight this area in order to give the model components definition. Don\'t paint the rest of the model as being lit from overhead!
Please refer to the dwarf cannon model earlier in this article, which is done really well by the way. Notice how everything not lit directly by the light source is very dark, this is because of the harsh lighting of the muzzle blast. Your scene is very similar, one intense light source. The back of the cannon is like your model on the pyre, there should probably be very little of the model being hit by light. Mr. Shawn\'s reference to imagining a paint bomb going off is a good analogy to figuring out where the light is going to hit.
One thing that you can do is take a similarly shaped model hold it upside down and shine a flashlight from above. You should be able to see where the light is hitting the model and use this as a guide. You might have to fudge some additional lighted areas on the model if there are too few in real life. This might help the model read better in this case.
Let me know if you need more illustrations to help clarify what I\'m talking about. I tend to ramble on a lot.
Good luck!
