Space Wolf Dreadnaught....Rating low?

[SpectralDragon]

http://coolminiornot.com/258940

So, 4.6 5 is table top worthy. I put over 40 hours into this dread. I admit to being a little miffed at this. Can someone at least tell me what is so wrong with it that it's not even worth playing with it?

 

[gohkm]

Can't speak for others, but I think the paintwork looks patchy and unsmooth. Look at the shield on its left chest, for example - just above the crest is an area that is patchily black. That doesn't lend itself well to creating an illusion of depth or coverage. The patchiness makes the whole dreadnought look unfinished. If you're going for the weathered look, there's a lot of tutorials here that cover different techniques in great detail.

Also, the shield crest, in particular, looks especially dull. There's none of the brightness one would associate with well-done metallics, for instance. The skull also looks painted a uniform shade of gray, without any shading nor highlighting.

There are a few nice things about the dreadnought which I like, though: you've got edge highlighting, for one. I think the hard edges could be softened and blended back into the panels, which would make it look nicer, but that's only my opinion. And you've got soft scuff marks all over - especially prominent on its right shoulder, which is a nice start to weathering.

The fig would probably look good at 3 feet or more, which is definitely table-top worthy in my book, but more than that ... sorry.

Besides, no point in feeling miffed - you did have fun painting the dreadnought, right? That's what counts. You'll even that ranking out at around 50+ votes, which is a truer indication of the ranking. Besides, it's a tough crowd here on CMON. Lighten up - keep painting, keep trying out new techniques, and eventually you'll improve. Some of the other painters here took more than a while to breach the 8+ barrier.

The most important thing is - paint for fun!

 

[SpectralDragon]

That's the thing, it's not supposed to look smooth, it's supposed to be very rough looking. I can see your point however, if the entire model is painted that way it might give the illusion of a half finished model. I hadn't thought of that, thank you.

Looking at the pic, it's not showing the 4 layers I put into the skulls. Just talked to someone here at home and they agree. Part of the problem is I need a better camera, or a better camera setup.

 

[gohkm]

That's one aspect - photography of minis is an art in and of itself. I would suggest that in order for it to look rough, you look at some weathering tutorials? I went through the same phase you did, and painted up a whole batch of Deathwing terminators in almost exactly the same way (but my rough patches were brown, not black).

Specifically for the skull, though, I reckon you need higher contrast between the midtones and any shadows and highlights. Bad angling most assuredly plays a part, but building more contrast into your tones is also an important aspect of painting. Try pushing things a bit - shade deeper than you normally would, and highlight brighter than you normally would. Above all, though, I'd suggest first getting on a smooth, even coat all over.

Don't diss it before you try it - it took me a while to learn that having a smooth and even basecoat means everything goes on better.

 

[SpectralDragon]

That's one aspect - photography of minis is an art in and of itself. I would suggest that in order for it to look rough, you look at some weathering tutorials? I went through the same phase you did, and painted up a whole batch of Deathwing terminators in almost exactly the same way (but my rough patches were brown, not black).

Specifically for the skull, though, I reckon you need higher contrast between the midtones and any shadows and highlights. Bad angling most assuredly plays a part, but building more contrast into your tones is also an important aspect of painting. Try pushing things a bit - shade deeper than you normally would, and highlight brighter than you normally would. Above all, though, I'd suggest first getting on a smooth, even coat all over.

Don't diss it before you try it - it took me a while to learn that having a smooth and even basecoat means everything goes on better.

The base coat is indeed smooth... a lot of what you are saying matches the pic, but not the dread itself. My fault for what is actually a bad picture The white highlights are full white, and I put a VERY heavy coat of wash on those bone parts.... it's just not showing on the pic. (I used a flash to take this pic if that says anything, not a good idea as someone recently told me )

 

[gohkm]

Ah! Bad pic, indeed! Bad flash, bad flash ! Then again, I read an instance where somebody put up a really good pic, and it showed up great on his monitor. He went over to a mate's house, on a different brand of monitor, and presto! el picto crapolata.

If you're already pushing highlights and shadows, then I would say try targeting specific areas for washing and shadowing. For instance, on the skull, heavy wash not the whole skull, but rather aim to stain the areas where the recesses naturally are - try painting on the wash directly into the recesses and crevices. Ditto for the highlights, just hit the high points. That'll give you an exaggerated light-to-dark illusion.

Did you just get the smooth basecoat on and then slather on the wash for the armour panels? That could potentially give rise to the patchiness.

 

[SpectralDragon]

no the patches are frankly terrible drybrushing with GW's "chaos black" (that color doesn't drybrush really well.)

I will try the targeted washing and highlighting, it's something I have been meaning to try anyway.

Thank you gohkm for all the very helpful advice, can I ask, is the scheme generally interesting?

 

[gohkm]

Drybrushing has its place, and personally, I'm quite fond of it for furry bits and edge highlighting where necessary. The colour scheme is a bit uniform. The slate grey look is fine, but you need the occasional bit of colour to break it up. Weathering with, say, rust-coloured pigments will alleviate the greyishness somewhat, as will weathering with nicks and cracks (since that gives you texture). But you might wish to consider a brilliant complementary colour - that's why GW does Space Wolves with huge swathes of golden yellow.

There's all sorts of 'balance' issues with using complementary colours, but that's another topic in its own right. For example, if you paint the dreadnought's shinguards brilliant yellow, then it'll look a bit bottom heavy. Or if you yellow up a shoulder and shinguard, it might look as if it's listing to one side. Judicious use is probably the way to go - say, black-and-yellow hazard stripes on the weapon shoulder or the CC arm. I'd suggest that you not be afraid of ruining the fig, but to go ahead and experiment.

To boldly paint where one has never painted before! Or, in this case, trying out new techniques. Avanti, and enjoy the journey!

 

[SpectralDragon]

Drybrushing has its place, and personally, I'm quite fond of it for furry bits and edge highlighting where necessary. The colour scheme is a bit uniform. The slate grey look is fine, but you need the occasional bit of colour to break it up. Weathering with, say, rust-coloured pigments will alleviate the greyishness somewhat, as will weathering with nicks and cracks (since that gives you texture). But you might wish to consider a brilliant complementary colour - that's why GW does Space Wolves with huge swathes of golden yellow.

There's all sorts of 'balance' issues with using complementary colours, but that's another topic in its own right. For example, if you paint the dreadnought's shinguards brilliant yellow, then it'll look a bit bottom heavy. Or if you yellow up a shoulder and shinguard, it might look as if it's listing to one side. Judicious use is probably the way to go - say, black-and-yellow hazard stripes on the weapon shoulder or the CC arm. I'd suggest that you not be afraid of ruining the fig, but to go ahead and experiment.

To boldly paint where one has never painted before! Or, in this case, trying out new techniques. Avanti, and enjoy the journey!

Thanks again, you've been a great help, happy painting to you!

 

[Tabris_]

Well... it happens to all of us when we are noobs, my lastest mini was a hard work and received a low grade to. It's important to learn why so you can improve even more.

BTW, i've seen a similar technique in a Brazilian WH forum i visit and i'm sure it's almost always seen negatively. I strongly suggest you do as others said and instead research on weathering.

 

[SpectralDragon]

Well... it happens to all of us when we are noobs, my lastest mini was a hard work and received a low grade to. It's important to learn why so you can improve even more.

BTW, i've seen a similar technique in a Brazilian WH forum i visit and i'm sure it's almost always seen negatively. I strongly suggest you do as others said and instead research on weathering.

I've been painting models for four years, I'm not a noob

 

[Tercha]

"I've been painting models for four years, I'm not a noob" I have been painting for 40 years - and I am

 

[tidoco2222]

Honestly I think from that photo thatthe model is scoring what it deserves I know that is harsh but look at it, the model looks like it has been roughly drybrushed and then extreme highlighted on the edges, there is a nasty mould line/join on the power fist the barrels of the other weapon have not been drilled out or painted in any way that would make them look hollowed out, the metals are lacking the shield looks rushed and the base is poor.
If you want to get higher scores look at photos in the range you are aiing for and see what you need to do to achieve that. You say that you put about 40 hours into the model from that photo alone it looks more like four at the most.

 

[Beamo]

Painting aside, mold lines and undrilled weapon barrels will kill the look of the model, and your score.

The pic isn't very good either, but I have trouble taking good pics, myself.

The hard truth is that your current score is pretty fair, but if you cleaned the lines, drilled the melta, and broke up some of the grey with another color you might be using in the rest of the army, the score should come up some.

 

[SpectralDragon]

So with 5 being tabletop quality, your saying this isn't, basically? Even with such a terrible picture, that's far too harsh. Nobody ever get a rating higher than 6 with you guys?

 

[BPI]

Hi SpectralDragon, I find the descriptions that come with the vote numbers a bit frustrating. Does 4 say "Not Good"? I wish it were more encouraging. I've voted 4s for plenty of minis that'll look good on the table & that I think are fine. 3s tend to be a bit scrappier It's just that if I vote at least a 5 on everything, the scale becomes too compressed. An Ultramarine army spray painted blue, glued to grey bases with red eyes dotted in will look fine on the table, far better than unpainted but they'll get a 2 from me, not a 5. The score has nothing to do with whether it gets used in a game!

Not true I realise. Something getting an 8-10, no way my drunk D&D players are putting their snack encrusted mits on that mini as they shove it about the table & throw dice at it

Regards your model. It's a Dreadnought & therefore not cool, I'll skip past it in the Gallery. Personal preference & all that jazz

Plenty of good advice in the posts above though

Cheers, B.

 

[Empchild]

I've come to find coolmini more then anywhere elsewhere is fairly spot on (save a few here and there) for painting scores. Now I won a demon and the entry I won with is at a 7. I would honestly tend to agree as I know these could of been better had I put more work into them but sometimes time is a crutch. You honestly can't get upset with a score ever because on the internet anything is far game and with you posting it here you are asking for people to criticize your models... heavily. Many of the best painters in the world frequent this site and they set the standard fairly high. With that they also give "free" advice on how they do what they do. Some models are great but photograph poorly that is a sad truth, but with that I am sure this just makes you want to drive harder. I used to live out your way in Washington and worked at the bunker out there and I know their are a lot of AMAZING painters in that area that would give you some whole hearted tips andhelp on improving. With that I bid you good luck and I look forward to seeing what you produce in the future.

 

[tidoco2222]

I think it has been mentioned in another thread before that the scoring system here has not changed for a good few years but painting expectations and the quality of paintwork has increased what was tabletop a few years back would not make the cut for alot of people today, to me that is not tabletop but that is my opinion alone. I think it was Spacemunkie that said "if you want better scores paint better miniatures" a harsh but simple fact.
We all to some degree expect higher than we actually get that is human nature the main thing to remember is pretty unimportant at the end of the day but there are alot of members here that come to see cool paintjobs and seeing things like the mold lines and the areas of the mini that could easily be improved without alot of effort tend to lower te scoring potential straight away. I'll be honest I gave it a four because to me I think that is where it is at and I wouldn't want it in my army. A dread is a big mini and therefore a standout mini that should have the best you can do on it for that reason alone.

 

[MightyChad]

Keep working. The first mini I posted was a low 5, and I had put just as many hours on a smaller mini a Chaos Sorceror I think. It all takes practice, and start posting in the WIP section. That way you can get feedback as you work. And if you put in the time and effort, YOU WILL GET BETTER. Take advantage of all the great painters on this site, ask them questions, and USE whatever advice you are given. But don't get discouraged.

 

[supervike]

I don't see the referenced submission, did the OP pull it?