GW does it again !!!

[dave12]

ofcourse GW has the right to do what they want. As we also have the right to complain. People also have the right to disagree with me, but i think bringing certain topics into this conversation such as calling westerners greedy SOB\'s is plain out rediculous. UNCALLED for if you ask me. :flame:

 

[LavronYor]

Reality check, simple comparisons.

If no one is going to jump on my soapbox, then I will again. Let\'s do a little reality check. Did I miss the thread about the US going to war and then gas prices jumped out of sight and not a single painter complained about Shell, BP, Gulf. Did anyone get a raise in the last year? Did anyone notice a few weeks ago, that some old guy died after ten years of taxpayer life support, initials RR. So companies raise prices. Would you rather that they lose money, close stores, don\'t expand game lines, and don\'t produce more new sculpts, not to mention promote a GamesDay at a town near you. You can all still come to Baltimore once a year and lose to the same 5 or 6 painters who kick everyone\'s a**. But, let\'s compare, the prices went up at most $5 on several things. If you eat a double cheeseburger twice a week instead of a Quarter pounder, you have just saved that $5. If you eat a steak dinner, say $15 that\'s three items. And 24 hours later, that steak dinner is still s***. If you buy an overpriced mini, and paint it nicely, tomorrow it is still something to be proud of. Just buy smarter. Most minis sit like little velveteen rabbits, just waiting to be painted to a 6 or better standard and played with like the excellent toys that they are. Stop bitching about their price, or maybe you should be strapped into the penitent engine and have your accelerator stomped.

ps do people really skip over the really lengthy rants
pps sh** I thought so.

ppps if Butterbur forgets to mail this I really shall melt him

 

[Grey Mouser]

Originally posted by darthfoley
I\'m a little confused by that last bit.

My impression of Rackham is they are every bit as expensive as GW (most models I\'ve seen run at least 7.99).

I understand that you don\'t need nearly as many figures to play a game of Confrontation, but single figure prices seem equal to me..

Yes and you don\'t need as many to play a game like the many many many you need to play Warhammer. I don\'t mind paying more when I don\'t need an endless amount to play.

 

[Trevor]

I was thinking about this a bit more (dangerous I know).

I started seriously getting into minis around age 13, I had very little money and I distinctly remember working my ass off in summer jobs for a pittance and thinking \"a few more hours of this and I\'ll have that 12 pounds for that box of terminators\".

Even back then minis were \"expensive\" for an average teenager, and we eagerly awaited sales and store openings so we could get as much lead for our money as possible.

I don\'t think in real terms the prices are much different, computer games used to be around 5-10 pounds, a box of minis 10, how much are games now? About the same as a box of minis...

Finally I don\'t think anyone will disagree that the quality has improved considerably, especially in the plastics, so maybe they are actually better value now than back then...

 

[Grey Mouser]

Originally posted by LavronYor
So companies raise prices. Would you rather that they lose money, close stores, don\'t expand game lines, and don\'t produce more new sculpts, not to mention promote a GamesDay at a town near you. You can all still come to Baltimore once a year and lose to the same 5 or 6 painters who kick everyone\'s a**.

ps do people really skip over the really lengthy rants
pps sh** I thought so.

Nope read it all.

Wow, pardon me if I don\'t share your need to save my pennies to buy some GW because they need to stay in business BOO HOO no offense. I\'ve got White Dwarves all the way back to the low 100\'s LOL so I know how much the\'ve gone up and up.. They were twice the going rate of most other manufacturers in the 80\'s when their first plastic Marines came out and they were mostly rejected for the cost and the plastic by most gamers at the time.

Leaving that alone Games day tickets are in my humble opinion the most outrageous priced tickets on the planet, except maybe concert tickets. And you still have to buy the elusive Games day figure when you get there. I\'ve yet to attend one, there\'s nothing close to me. But it\'s not just the outrageous prices for things, How many times have the rules been changed, forcing players to buy whole new units and books to go with the new changes if they want to keep up, and what\'s that I see on the horizon a new set of rules coming around the corner. I see more money being spent. Cha CHING!

Most of all it\'s an attitude that I heard once from a GW Rep when I approached him on these very subjects about 3 years ago at a con. His answers were \"they don\'t care and I wasn\'t their Ideal customer anymore\" in Essence I wasn\'t the demographic they were trying to reach. I supposedly had all the miniatures I was going to buy and now it was time to work over the next crowd for new blood and money.

In addition he said they make the rules to sell the mini\'s. They don\'t make the mini\'s to sell rules. My best friend close at hand remarked they have the best marketing strategy on the planet.

They had a good run at things for a long, long time and if the price increase or the economy makes them fall apart then so be it. Personally I don\'t want to pay for the extra fluff or the new packaging or the increase in supplies. I used to be a vendor a long time ago and the mark up is unbelievable in the first place. Actual cost for product is so low its eye watering.

Feel sorry for them NOT TODAY!

~ P.S. nobody misses the news, went to that gulf war thing once already and fixing to go back again. Reagan is gone. and I come here to get away from that all that stuff!

 

[Rachel]

this is long too...

Originally posted by LavronYor
ps do people really skip over the really lengthy rants
pps sh** I thought so.

Only when the ranter (no, not just you ) fails \'Return Key 101\'. It\'s just too hard to read an enormous block of unseparated text.

And yes, lots of things increase in price. However, given that these forums are attached to a miniature-painting site, I don\'t think it\'s unreasonable that people complain about the increased price of minis before the increased price of petrol .

Having said that - my husband\'s been playing these games for about 15 years or so. Locally prices are about up to where they were 13 years ago when GW stock was imported by the main games store in town and a massive mark-up added. About 40% apparently - hows that for the \'good\' independent games store vs the \'evil\' company?

It\'s interesting that the US is getting a price hike - one thing I do know about the prices in various countries is that they have less to do with the exchange rate than with negotiations between the high level staff. The US guys always insist on the cheapest price band (probably due to being so big, which isn\'t entirely unreasonable).

The US is *still* the cheapest place in the world to buy GW stock. For example, just last week we picked up a 40k novel (not one of the good ones) for $18.95 NZ. This is about the standard price for a paperback in NZ - the range is about $16.95-22.95 for a normal sized paperback.

The UK price for this is equivalent to about $20 NZ. The US price? would be $11 NZ. It would be cheaper for me to mail order GW stuff from the US than buy it locally if the US didn\'t have such high postage costs (the UK mail order store is quite reasonable).

Pretty much everything is getting more expensive if you want the latest version of anything. And that\'s a choice. I like all sorts of minis, so I\'m prepared to pay the high prices of GW or Rackham - I don\'t play Confrontation so the prices seem really high to me. However, I used to play 40k, so I can see how the price balances out if you play with any frequency.

Sure a mini\'s expensive, but you can use it as long as you like (unlike a lot of computer games that are boring once you\'ve finished them). Some folks at the local wargaming club have one army that they\'ve had for years. My husband, on the other hand, goes through at least one army a year and tends to do pretty expensive, bits-intensive conversions throughout the army. He spends a *crapload*. It\'s a choice.

Plenty of hobbies are insanely expensive - they can be, because they\'re optional. A ski-pass to one of the slopes in the central north island costs more than the average army - and that\'s just for the season, and certainly doesn\'t include gear hire or purchase.

Club fees for most sports are high (even before equipment costs), my annual gym membership is about the same as an army which is before you add the cost of a fortnightly workout with a personal trainer... Let\'s see... the Film Festival here starts in a couple of weeks, plenty of people plan to go to most of the films for an average cost of $10 per movie (thats for the cheap sessions) - That\'ll cost more than a standard army easily. And it\'s only 2-3 weeks of intensive movie-going. It\'s all optional. Movie prices are going up and up but there aren\'t any placard waving protesters standing outside theatres.

Just because something used to be a fringe-community-based hobby doesn\'t mean the companies involved have to be altruistic. Hell, Reaper\'s prices have been steadily increasing for the last few years... Freebooter are pretty pricey, even more than Rackham... Haven\'t heard any complaints about them though.

 

[War Griffon]

Originally posted by Sturmhalo
Ohhh... just checked your profile. You must be Pontprennau way then (across the road from Griffin?).

Yep 5 minutes walk, 2minutes in the car.
I\'ve never played Mordhiem though but I\'m game for a go at most games.
The biggest problem I have is working away all the time however, I have three weeks off at the end of the month so PM me if you want to try and organise something.

 

[t_haye2]

Now there was this game you could buy, just a photocopied rag really, that had rules for wargames using lego men....now that is the perfect \'proxy\'! your 5000 pts chaos army against my 5000 pts lego clone army...giggle..anybody kniow if those rules are on the net somewhere?lollollollollol

Fact is, you never hear people complain about Mattel raising their prices, and Games workshop is a TOY company, who have no intention to go back in time and be a \'miniature wargame\' company. They\'ve expanded to computer games, comics, books, large scale collectables, and even the CEO has at several times made statements that in 10 years time the business of Games workshop will mostly not revolve around miniatures, although it will always be part of the business...you didn\'t know they were looking into getting action figures done, did you?

Fact is, it\'s a multi million pound business, growing out of the cottage industry that is toy soldiers, and becoming a serious contender in the toy market. I just find all this whining about \'it\'s not fair, my life is over because I can\'t buy that £40 pound model\' is very childish. If I piss people off with that, so be it, water off my back. i just want people to stop doing this every two years(because Gw does increas etheir prices every two years), and just get on with it. They\'re not going to change for you, or anybody else. grrrr....

:flame:

and again i\'m ranting, must be my period

 

[Ebonbuddha]

BOOM!!!! lol On target.

Originally posted by dave12
why do people have to bring third world nations and starving children into this discussion? If you don\'t like the fact that some of us are concerned about the price increases, thats fine. Although, the fact is it is getting quite expensive for some people. I personally have no problem affording the minatures even at the new prices, but I\'m arguing for the sake of a person who is saying \"man, i wish i could afford to play (or continue playing)warhammer.\" Back to the fact of people saying \"oh well you should donate your money to charity.\" Maybe so, but this is my money and personally, if i cared about everything that was \'wrong\' with the world I dont think id ever get much time where i didnt have something to worry about. The sad fact is, is that some people are not that well off. This usually (almost always) is caused the form of government the country has. Until the gov\'ts are changed in these country, our efforts are going to do very little to change the whole economy or level of living in country \'x\'. But you know what? Thats LIFE. If you want to give your all of your mini money for charity, then I say you are a great person. But please stop saying, instead of complaining about 5 bucks why dont you just not buy it and give it to charity. This is too discuss the price raise that GW made. If you dont agree that the price change sucks, then dont come here and tell us not to complain. We are the consumer and we have the right to complain.

 

[Grey Mouser]

Hey does anybody no the reason Tin is up.. well it\'s because China and some other 3rd world countries are industrializing like crazy...

-Goes with a recent post.

Be careful what you wish for you might get it.

1. GW raises the price of plastic and lead about every time they feel like it. No set pattern, just when it feels right. Rackham, and a few new \"independants\" aside they are the most expensive based on amounts needed to play in one of their games in the business seconded only to Foundry who thinks they are \"gods gift\" to Historicals.

- Foundry is still at a level GW was several years ago but not the same quality as GW.

2. GW makes plastic figures/soldiers, to save on costs. Hey I remember those! I played with those when I was a kid.

3. GW changes their rules every time they need a price increase to sell more figures, to justify the price increase, and stay in business.

4. GW sucks everybody into the madness by clever ads and paintjobs ( I admit to falling victim to this on more than one occassion) in their magazines, and by telling you, you must have these things to play in their proprietary game which according to them is the best on the planet and it changes at least once every other year or 2. When it\'s not a 40K change it\'s a WHFB change or some other new off shoot which they will support for about a year or two and then drop like a rock.

\" Sheer Genious\" -Wile E. Coyote

- Hey I don\'t mind paying for quality. Things should improve. Is Plastic an improvement? I don\'t like it but thats just me. I bought airfix hard plastic multipose figures in the 70\'s and 80\'s. I don\'t game with them even though I could have.

- I don\'t mind paying for inflation Reaper is currently at the price GW was 5 years ago or longer? Oh, and by the way they don\'t sell plastic and the 7th,8th,9th incarnations of rules sets. ( a little exagerated I\'m sure)

Look there are more expensive things out there no doubt. I don\'t do them. I Game, I paint. I could buy a porsche too but I don\'t ..well maybe someday.

Is the above bad, no it\'s marketing and brilliant marketing to boot. I\'ve said I wouldn\'t buy them time and time again. I always end up in the line checking out with a mini. Does not mean I can\'t complain about them??? I\'ve been doing it for years!! I won\'t play the 40K or the WHFB games anymore but I still buy the occassional GW mini and with the new price increase maybe I still will but it\'s a lot less than I spend on other vendors.


Hey feed the machine I insist and so does GW it\'s how they stay in business.

 

[Woland]

Originally posted by Grey Mouser

it changes at least once every other year or 2. When it\'s not a 40K change it\'s a WHFB change or some other new off shoot which they will support for about a year or two and then drop like a rock.

\" Sheer Genious\" -Wile E. Coyote

Oh come on. They revise the ruleset every seven years, and if they didn\'t you\'d have tossers complaining \"GW refuses to fix their broken ruleset!\"

I\'m as unhappy about the price increase as anyone, but what can you do?

I have my own consipiracy theory on the issue: the US may be paying the price for our lousy economy! GW does a lot of sales in the US, but the dollar is pretty much worthless against the Pound right now. (Not much better against the Euro, for that matter.) While GW has US offices, they\'re still HQ\'d in the UK, and I\'m guessing most of the money the US office takes in flows back across the Atlantic. If US sales are down--not due to quantity, but due to exchange rate problems--they\'re going to have to recoup that lost income somewhere.

And, of course, there is the problem with oil and tin. And shipping costs world-wide have skyrocketed due to oil and security concerns. And inflation is creeping up again. And....you get the picture.

Point being: It both sucks and blows, but there is an argument to be made in support of it, and everyone knows they\'ll continue to pray to the GW Money Gods as often as they can.

 

[Flashman14]

Before I ask this question I must point out that though miniatures are indeed a luxury item, unlike ferraris and yachts and whatever else has been mentioned, miniatures have always been affordable and available to all income brackets. So to compare them to the unaffordability of vehicles is not really fair or valid.

Now, the defenders of the price increase have done very well. But surely everyone has a limit. My main point has been that that limit has ben crossed for many people.

But my question to the defenders is: How much is too much for a mini?

Where do you guys draw the line? Surely there\'s a point where you say, \"Rubbish, I\'m not paying that.\"

Click here to vote and comment (read the parameters carefully - I\'ve tried to keep it objective and fair):

HERE

 

[Prophet]

Did you ever stop to think just how many of those starving third world children GW employs? Gotta\' keep costs down.