Black spray primer (GW)

[TheIRA]

I love the GW chaos black primer, but it is just WAY too expensive! I have tried 4-5 other brands of flat black spray paint but I have been sorely disappointed with all of them so far. I have tried them ranging from Walmart 1.50 flat black to a 8.99 name brand from a local hobby store. The best so far sadly was a Walmart brand, but it had too many and too large of clumps in it. The expensive one I tried was watery but dried very thick, but also was like tar...it never did fully set up and stayed sticky and wetish. The worst one dried like dust. I could even strip it off just by rubbing the model with my fingers.

Does anyone know of a good replacement for the GW Primer? I know they do not make their own stuff...but what brand is it really?

Thanks for any help! My last can just ran out tonight...:crying:

 

[gohkm]

I use Tamiya Fine Surface Spray. Doesn't come in black, but rather white or grey. It dries to a very nice, almost rubbery finish that gives paint an awful lot of bite. Stuff's pricey, though.

 

[Einion]

Open secret Ira - Chaos Black ain't primer, it's just paint. Given that, I'm amazed it's not fairly easy to at least match it!

I usually recommend auto primer (or something similar) but it's difficult to find in black. Krylon and Rust-Oleum (in their Painter's Touch range) both make one, but I think they're harder to locate than the more usual colours of white or grey so ordering online is probably the way to go. Prices can be excellent that way so it's no bad thing, despite the hassle.

Einion

 

[TheIRA]

Open secret Ira - Chaos Black ain't primer, it's just paint. Given that, I'm amazed it's not fairly easy to at least match it!

I usually recommend auto primer (or something similar) but it's difficult to find in black. Krylon and Rust-Oleum (in their Painter's Touch range) both make one, but I think they're harder to locate than the more usual colours of white or grey so ordering online is probably the way to go. Prices can be excellent that way so it's no bad thing, despite the hassle.

Einion

Well, it is the spray can seen here: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat470015a&prodId=prod1200064 They call it "undercoat" now, but I had an older can that called it Primer right under the chaos black. I used it as paint on my ok painted Tau before and use it as primer now.

I tried Krylon, it was the one that with 2 different cans (2 colors). Perhaps they were just bad/old cans though. I never tried rustoleum, I have used it lots for metal/automotive applicantions though. It being designed for metal/rust I did not think it would bound well with plastic models. Have you (or anyone else) ever tried it with GW plastics/resins?

Thank you for your help!

 

[Routaporsas]

Well have you tried Army painter products? http://usshop.thearmypainter.com/products.php?ProductGroupId=2

They have Black primer and it's slightly cheaper too. I haven't yet tested.

Hmmm...Weird if GW's spray "primer" is not actually a primer, for that's what they claim. And many retailers sell it as Primer. Though I have used GW white primer/paint/WhatEverItIs for years and I haven't had any problems with it. I tested maston Primer, and actually that GW spray was a lot better IMO.
And it seems to behave like primer. For if you spray proper coats, the finish will be just lightly rough and therefore paint will attach like it should. I mean, isn't that one thing that primers should do?

 

[RuneBrush]

Well have you tried Army painter products? http://usshop.thearmypainter.com/products.php?ProductGroupId=2

They have Black primer and it's slightly cheaper too. I haven't yet tested.

Hmmm...Weird if GW's spray "primer" is not actually a primer, for that's what they claim. And many retailers sell it as Primer. Though I have used GW white primer/paint/WhatEverItIs for years and I haven't had any problems with it. I tested maston Primer, and actually that GW spray was a lot better IMO.
And it seems to behave like primer. For if you spray proper coats, the finish will be just lightly rough and therefore paint will attach like it should. I mean, isn't that one thing that primers should do?

The old GW primer is the same as the new GW undercoat - just with a different spray nozzle that covers your finger in paint When all GW produced was metal and plastic's it could be used as a primer & undercoat for everything they made, however with the introduction of more resin bits (including FW) it doesn't have enough adherence to be a true primer.

Personally, although it's flaming expensive (£9.50 for a can from the local shop) it's probably the best black undercoat you can get. I use Plastikote Grey Primer with is between £5 and £7 for a 400ml can if I need that bit better adherence (or a grey base).

 

[finn17]

I've tried them all and the only two decent black basecoats IMO are the GW one (It hurts me to say that...) and the Army Painter version.

 

[TheIRA]

I've tried them all and the only two decent black basecoats IMO are the GW one (It hurts me to say that...) and the Army Painter version.

:excruciating: I was afraid that may be the case . Army Painter looks pretty good, but at only $2.50 less then what my local store has theirs marked as, I guess I will just stick with GW then as I wouldn't save any money at all after shipping unless I was buying a lot of stuff from them.

 

[TheIRA]

The old GW primer is the same as the new GW undercoat - just with a different spray nozzle that covers your finger in paint When all GW produced was metal and plastic's it could be used as a primer & undercoat for everything they made, however with the introduction of more resin bits (including FW) it doesn't have enough adherence to be a true primer.

Personally, although it's flaming expensive (£9.50 for a can from the local shop) it's probably the best black undercoat you can get. I use Plastikote Grey Primer with is between £5 and £7 for a 400ml can if I need that bit better adherence (or a grey base).

I thought they would be the same. I have used both (new one was a store can) and they seemed to dry and apply the same...with the exception you pointed out that now 1/3 of the paint goes on you and the nozzle instead of on the model.

I'm glad you pointed out that it does not work on the new Finecast stuff and ForgeWorld. What kind of primer (black or grey preferably) would you recommend for them? It does not matter too much what it costs as a single can will do me for YEARS with it if that's all I use it for.

 

[Einion]

GW can describe Chaos Black as anything they like, doesn't make it primer until they reformulate it (fat chance!) to actually be primer

Einion

 

[Dragonsreach]

I've tried them all and the only two decent black basecoats IMO are the GW one (It hurts me to say that...) and the Army Painter version.

Have you tried Halfords Black plastic primer. I`ve used it without problem. (ditto the grey,red &white)I found that it dries 90% quicker than GW`s stuff and has a nicer `tooth` for painting on.I`ve also used Plasticoste primer but find that takes up to 24 hours to dry, not what I want in a primer.

 

[finn17]

Have you tried Halfords Black plastic primer. I`ve used it without problem. (ditto the grey,red &white)I found that it dries 90% quicker than GW`s stuff and has a nicer `tooth` for painting on.I`ve also used Plasticoste primer but find that takes up to 24 hours to dry, not what I want in a primer.

I've certainly tried Halford's primer, but I can't remember if it was the 'plastic' one. I might check it out, is there any financial saving over GW?

 

[QuietiManes]

Dupli-Color Sandable Primer is good stuff. It's cheap. Comes in white, grey, black, red and rust (dirty red)...probably won't find all the colours on the shelf though. You can get it at auto shops, home hardware centers and Walmart carries it too.

 

[finn17]

The trouble with most non mini-specific undercoats/primers in my experience is that they are designed to fill in any minor imperfections. Exactly what you dont want when priming a mini

 

[Dragonsreach]

I've certainly tried Halford's primer, but I can't remember if it was the 'plastic' one. I might check it out, is there any financial saving over GW?

Steve think about what you've written. :rofl:

 

[finn17]

Steve think about what you've written. :rofl:

Okay, okay...it's obviously much cheaper...

 

[Einion]

Okay, okay...it's obviously much cheaper...

Well duh :rotfl:

Einion

 

[3dken]

Paint

Have you tried the Wal-mart brand of flat black? The one with the blue label that costs $.99? That's the one I use, and I swear by it. It goes on smooth and thin with great coverage and doesn't clog details. Also, it's the same hue of black as GW's Chaos black, unlike some other flat blacks/primers. It comes in black, white and grey primer (real primer). It use to come in Oxide Red (primer), but they stopped making it. That sucks for me because I was using it to undercoat my Skaven!

Here's a pix of the can:

 

[BPI]

I'm currently ussing the Halfords stuff too (grey can with coloured top). The metal primer in red/white/black all are fine though I oversprayed with the red and it all got a bit too rough and toothy and proceeded to take 3 times as much paint to get the mini done as normal I've only got their red plastic primer (will have to look for black & white next time) but I really like it, seems smoother than the metal one (though I suppose plastic minis are generallly smoother than metal so I may be imagining things). Their matt black spraypaint I'm happy with too. Perhaps not as matt or deep black as some more expensive brands but does the job I want at an acceptable price point.

Not much use for those outside the UK I suppose but definately play with different makes from the auto store rather than paying for expensively branded hobby product. Especially if you're an army painter, if you're doing four competition minis a year then I guess cost is less of an issue.

Cheers, B.

 

[freakinacage]

I'm currently ussing the Halfords stuff too (grey can with coloured top). The metal primer in red/white/black all are fine though I oversprayed with the red and it all got a bit too rough and toothy and proceeded to take 3 times as much paint to get the mini done as normal I've only got their red plastic primer (will have to look for black & white next time) but I really like it, seems smoother than the metal one (though I suppose plastic minis are generallly smoother than metal so I may be imagining things). Their matt black spraypaint I'm happy with too. Perhaps not as matt or deep black as some more expensive brands but does the job I want at an acceptable price point.

x2
not that i use special placcy primer, just the normal grey