Thinning paints?

[jonp]

I can help with the mini stripping.

Pop to Tesco, ASDA or.where ever you feel like and pick up a bottle of fairy power spray (green spray bottle)

My method is putting my minis in a plastic tub then spray with the fairy and put the lid on the tub, leave it 30 mins.
Take a mini out scrub it with a cheap toothbrush until all the paint has gone.

Soak it in water with washing up liquid, and give it a scrub with a fresh toothbrush, just to make sure there's no vanish left.

Then just leave it to dry.

I don't know how you are priming them, some primer comes off some doesn't.

 

[Jbickley00]

You may find sticking to one brand of paints limiting after a time. Gw does have a good paint by numbers feel, and is very accessible in that way,but the real trick is to see the color, not just read it off the label. Once you see the color (or even more technically, the pigment) then color matching becomes very intuitive. And you will appreciate the subtle variations in color. Think about an Orc unit where each model is relively unique in skin tone because you have mix the green differently for each model.
As far as loading th brush and flow control - this is really a "feel" that develops over time. Brush loading an flow control are one of the ore skills developed with practice. It really does not matter hat level you at painting to-your second army will improve on your irst, and so on.

 

[GamerDad]

Thanks for that, jonp! I wonder why the GW guy told me there was no way to strip plastic minis.... I've seen some YT vids on this so will give it a try. I prime with GW Skull White, don't use too much, so I hope that's going to be okay.

Jbickley, I see your point re: paint range but at this early point in the hobby, I don't have the time, money, or even patience to make such a big experiment. It's enough of a problem working with GW's range. My goal at this point is to have a useable army that doesn't hurt me too much to look at it; I'll leave the experimentation and "proper prep time" for a later date.

 

[TrystanGST]

Oh, you can strip plastic minis alright. You just have to be careful, depending on your stripping agent of choice, that you don't soften the plastic and end up damaging it with your brush. I use undiluted Pine Sol to strip, and anything longer than a few hours is enough to soften plastic/resin. Just something to be mindful of.

 

[Trevor]

What jonp said for stripping minis, although you can leave plastic minis in the fairy power spray for days with no ill effects.

 

[Wombat85]

Brake fluid does wonders and you have a few days before it will soften resins/ plastics but be sure to test this for the specific plastic before you take my word for it.

 

[jonp]

Yea like Trevor said the fairy stuff is great for leaving them in.

I accidently left some Ork boyz in a container covered in the stuff for over a year and they didn't soften.

 

[GamerDad]

I just got Fairy Power Spray and it worked great! Took of the primer and the few layers of paint, wasn't too hard to brush off. I got some residue left in the cracks so a second "wash" might work. I left my mini on for 3 hours, just sprayed and left in a sealed container (not airtight). I'm now testing on a mini that has had paint on for more than a year, see if that'll peel off too.

 

[TrystanGST]

The only stuff I've been largely unable to remove is the old GW colored primer. That stuff bonded with the plastic, I swear.

 

[Master Splinter]

I as a newbie did'nt thin my paint or wash, but doing several or a thined layers helps. Also, try to learn to blend. I only have a few techniques under my belt and that's washing, drybrushing and blending. This is for gaming purposes, most people here will help you further than that.

You best use Vallejo paints as the colors are far smarter than, say, citadel.

 

[Ninjii]

Tricky question, the problem is that it is really hard to solve this question on a forum. The best is that an experimented painter shows you his technique and have an exchange of what you want to aim as a result.
Some painting video can help, but will not solve it... Only one way is to practice several times on different minis with a precise goal, try, try and try again until you achieve it.
Some advice:
- your brush must be damp, not full of paint, you need to remove 80% on a paper towel before applying, bu pushing the paint where you want the color to be, the paint must almost dry directly after application, then directly apply a new layer. you can apply 10 layers in few minutes...
- You can use Vallejo Glaze medium, it keep the pigments together, adding a drop will make your paint thinner, transparent but blending will be smoother by removing the tension from the water you use in your dilution
- Use Good brush, favorite is natural Kolinsky brush, Raphael, Winsor and Newton, etc... it will help to keep some paint in the bristle and the point stay in shape during the application of the paint layers and layers. No need to recharge your brush between layers or reshape the point (less frustrating)

Then, if you stay here on CMON asking questions and showing pictures of your work, you will get many good advice. But really the best is to look for an experience painter to share this on a mini with him directly.

Regarding the medium for thinning paint, I use the lahmiam medium (or w.e the name is) from GW to thin my paints, washes, etc...never used water since that, seems to give much better colours. But I see you still advise water to dilution ?

 

[Chrispy]

Paint thinning brings into question the basic chemistry of paint. All paints are composed of 3 things- pigment, a binder (or vehicle) and a medium (or dilution). the pigment obviously gives paint it's color, the binder is what makes it stick, and the medium is what keeps the paint liquid. If there was no medium, paint would be like trying to put glue mixed with chalk dust on something.. not pretty. But the medium can also be further diluted by something else, usually water for most paint or oil for... oils. Diluting a paint too much makes all 3 components less, so in the extreme of 10 parts water to 1 part paint, you would have much of a color that would stick because everything has been broken down. Now, 'mediums' sold by companies are not just the paint medium, but it's binder as well. This makes them a better diluting agent than just water, but then they still need to be diluted since they are the same consistency of the paint. Enter the Flow-Aid http://www.liquitex.com/flowaid/, or any other agent that "improves flow" of paint. This breaks down the binder slightly so the paint can move better.
Personally, I use a mix of flow-aid, medium and water that changes depending on what I'm doing. I've also used slo-dri with flow-aid and haven't had any problems if both are kept to one or two drops. And, as always, you're looking for a paint the consistency of milk- whole milk. I once heard this and my art teacher said "Yeah, but that's skim milk consistency." When I diluted some airbrush paint too much.
And that's me take on it.
Pie.

 

[GamerDad]

I cleaned one of the old Space Marines that I got free from the GW shop as a "practice model" and I can only strip it down to what appears to be the black primer coat. While my Tau models would be stripped to the gray plastic, this Space Marine was still black. Oh well.

Once again, while I appreciate the advice, I'd like to keep it simple for now. Everyone seems to say "dilute with water," so that's what I'm doing. I assume that this is what most people do? Or does everyone have their own "concoction" preference?

 

[Dragonsreach]

Regarding the medium for thinning paint, I use the lahmiam medium (or w.e the name is) from GW to thin my paints, washes, etc...never used water since that, seems to give much better colours. But I see you still advise water to dilution ?

Yes people use water for dilution. Why? Because its a damn site cheaper.
GW lahmiam medium £2.30 for 12ml
Winsor & Newton Artists Flow Improver £5.80 for 125ml.

While Flow improvers slow drying time using them solely for dilution is an expensive way of thinning paints.
Water is out of the tap and less chance of you running out of it at a critial point in your painting.

 

[Ninjii]

Yes people use water for dilution. Why? Because its a damn site cheaper.
GW lahmiam medium £2.30 for 12ml
Winsor & Newton Artists Flow Improver £5.80 for 125ml.

While Flow improvers slow drying time using them solely for dilution is an expensive way of thinning paints.
Water is out of the tap and less chance of you running out of it at a critial point in your painting.

Well for me, i used only water for everything, but I realised that using a medium for the important pieces gave the best results. Of course this is teamed up with a wet palette which helps. But what you've said is quite right, it isn't cheap.

 

[ced1106]

Do you use a wet palette? I've noticed that it was easier to thin paints on a wet palette simply because I'd have random small drops of water on the palette. The parchment paper often wasn't flat, so I'd have surfaces to "wipe off" excess water or paint. I've learned not to mix more than a "brushful" of paint or water at a time, and wet palettes make that easier. Just drop a drop of water on one part of the parchment paper, paint somewhere else, and dip the brush in the paint or water. Smear the water or paint on another part of the palette, mix in another brushful.

A good glazing exercise is speed-painting using glazes on top of white primer. I used to use matte medium for glazes (easier for the thinned paint to stay on higher areas of the model), but became lazy and typically use water.
http://handcannononline.com/blog/2011/08/12/tutorial-basics-speed-demon-speed-painting-troopers/

 

[Wyrmypops]

I used to just add water. Since getting back into painting a couple of years ago I switched. Being in London, it's a heavy water area so tap water comes with enough impurities to show up. Also, water from the cleaning pot get murky awful quick and could show up in the mix too.

Now using an eye-dropper bottle (picked up mine from Antenocitis), it's alway to hand and simply a matter of adding a drop to the paint on the palette. Full of Distilled Water (picked up cheap off Ebay) to avoid the heavy impurities. Considering how little is used, it lasts a ruddy long time.
I added some drops of other stuff to make it even better. To 20 parts of the Distilled Water, 1 part Liquitex Flow-Aid, and 5 parts liquitex Slow-Dri (both from Antenocitis). Makes the paint managable for longer.

For painting a lot of the same thing (like a unit of soldiers or a tank) a wet palette is a good idea. I've not found it worth my time for doing single minis though, where the amount of paint needed is fine for just thinning on a regular palette. There's a few good threads on wet palettes, but chances are you might find you already have the stuff to make one yourself. I have a stack if lil uns, a blister pack case, foam insert loaded with water, a bit of parchment paper on top and it's done.

 

[Einion]

Also, water from the cleaning pot get murky awful quick and could show up in the mix too.

That's one of the reasons to use more than one pot. Double-bath rinsing not only keeps your brushes far cleaner during a session (and subsequently over time) it means you always have clean water available to dilute with in the second jar.

Einion

 

[RuneBrush]

One thing I would add to this is that the MM videos are showing you how to achieve a pretty high level of paint standard by somebody who has won awards. I've got most of them and it's great to watch these artists at work, but some time ago I accepted that I needed to develop my own style and preference to thinning, layering and such like after trying to replicate how these artists were doing things. The end result is that I know what I can achieve and how to achieve it.

Thinning paints really only gets easier with practice and I found that I tend to not thin my base colour anywhere near as much as the videos do. My shadow and highlight colours are thinned quite a bit more but again, still thicker than the videos do it. The other thing to bear in mind is that temperature and climate will effect how your paint goes on - a lot of people have dryer and warmer weather than I do in the UK, so they need to thin their paints further else they dry out too quickly. Because it's often bloody miserable, my paint will stay wet for longer with less thinning

pete