Taking the next step

Martin2D

New member
I\'ve been painting for a little over a year now. I started off painting Reaper miniatures, then started playing warhammer, but I\'m only very interested now in still painting. My problem is that I can\'t seem to take the next step. These are my highest rated minis:
http://www.coolminiornot.com/?id=15411
http://www.coolminiornot.com/?id=15007
I used to think that it was because I only spent 2-3 hours on these types of minis that I couldn\'t paint to a higher standard, but my minis just don\'t have the same \"look\" as the 7+ rating categories have. I was hoping you guys could give me some tips on how to get to the next level.

Thanks to anyone who has insight.
 

Coyote

New member
You asked for it, you get it.

1: Thinner paint.
2: Stop using washes for the majority of your shading.
3: Learn how to blend by layering
4: Practice with your brush. The banner shows this. You need to become comfortable with your brush and be able to apply a straight line of the same width in a single stroke. Brush and paint control are really what you need to work on.

Also, when doing flesh, study how light falls on muscle, get out a book on anatomy for artists and look at it. Look at paintings and portraits and look at where the highlights are.
 

Flashman14

New member
All what Coyote said plus:

My hand is prolly no better than yours but I do go back in and correct stuff all the time. That banner for example is a tricky task but just go back in and knockout those stray smudges that have come over the lines. Esp the anvil and the celtic paterns . . .

In general, I spend a significant amount of time cleaning up stray brush strokes. That\'s part of the \"skill\" of painting.

Otherwise, your work isn\'t too bad at all . . .
 

Martin2D

New member
Yeah, the banner was like 10 minutes, I didn\'t have the time to go back over it.

On the blending part. I\'ve tried so many times, I just can\'t understand where to put the stuff, it always looks like crap.
 

Flashman14

New member
Heh . . Ya resist the urge to post unless the mini is ready. I get antsy for opinions sometime and I want to post before I\'m done . . .

In fact I think that\'s my biggest problem: I work really hard on the face and fairly hard on the main parts of the uniform/costume but then when it comes down to the little details; belts, shoes, small equipment, etc I just lose interest and want to hurry up and get the damn thing completed. I lack patience. I have to try to work as hard on all the little stuff as I do the face and skin.

Oh, I should have recommended before - to those who used to and have not in awhile or for those of you who just don\'t - check out White Dwarf magazine. YOU! Stop moaning in the back!! I \'eard that! If it ever sucked in the past it certainly doesn\'t now.

But in all seriousness they have at least 2-3 articles in their \'Eavy Metal section. These routinely provide:
*Detailed paint recipes
*Painting techniques
*Step by step painting guides to the latest GW figs.

BUT even if you don\'t paint that particular figure the examples are usually stunning and the recipes have wide and practical application to anything you are painting . . .

I\'ve credited that particular journal many times as singular in it\'s assistance to my current work.

In terms of highlighting - I go back and forth on what\'s best but I think if you assume that the light is coming from directly overhead you\'ll be on track. This way the tops of everything get done.

Hope this helps . . .
 
S

Sturmhalo

Guest
Looks like you\'ve got the basics pretty much sorted (could be a little neater though). I guess you just need to get better at what you do! Sounds dumb I know, but that\'s all you need to do. Look at top notch paint jobs, read articles whether they be in WD or on CMON, or elsewhere (the old Heroes for Wargames book by Stewart Parkinson helped me hugely), and just practice. Over time you\'ll get better and better, and as you do so you develop a style all of your own.

One thing that I\'m convinced helped me to advance, and contrary to what most of us suggest, was taking long breaks from painting! I dropped in out of painting over the space of about 15 years. A couple of years off and after a few shakey starts, the quality of my work was always loads better than what was my best from previous years! Not necessarily helpful if you want to paint, but the time out really helped.
 

Martin2D

New member
Well, I couldn\'t have stopped painting for 15 years, I would\'ve had to have been painting in the womb.
 

Martin2D

New member
Well, because of this post I painted another mini. My best yet, I think. I didnt use washes, I used NMM on all the metal areas, and I tried a layered flesh tone. I\'ll post the page URL once it gets approved.

EDIT NEW LINK:
http://www.coolminiornot.com/pics/pics2/img3e61856fb71c4.jpg
 

Flashman14

New member
hmmm . . . What size brush are you using? is it in good shape, keeps it\'s point?

I think the highlights (on the new dwarf in particular) just need to be applied a bit neater - such that it doesn\'t go in unintended places; sometimes a bad brush will spread stuff all over. Like in the hair - there is the highlight color in amongst the cracks between strands when really it should just be on the strands.

Also layer EVERYTHING not just the skin. And when you do layer there should be 4-5 different shades at minimum.

I wish there was a shortcut to good painting but there really isn\'t - it takes a long time to mix up and blend the requisite layers.

Also the shade difference between the lightest shade and the darkest shade on any one part should be greater. Like in the hair, on the dwarf, it looks like you have 2 shades - the color and one slightly lighter. AT MINIMUM three layers are best on any one thing. Mix up a new batch of those lightest shades you\'ve used by adding more of either white or yellow or a tan and on each piece apply the paint to increasingly LESS areas on the mini. Know what I\'m saying? it\'s very hard for me to describe without illustrating it.

Here\'s an example; let\'s see if it helps: Imagine a circle (not a sphere)- This circle is filled with your deepest shade color say 75 %Scab Red: 25% Black - start with that and let it dry.
Now, within that circle, paint a smaller concentric circle using JUST 100% scab red. Let that dry.
Now mix 75% Scab Red to 25% Blazing Orange - paint another smaller concentric circle with that mix. Let it dry.
Add a little Fiery Orange to the mix you just made up so that it is 50% scab red and 50% oranges. Make another smaller concentric circle on top of the others. See where I\'m going with this?

On a mini, these smaller areas are higher points on the mini - each raised area gets a slightly lighter color than the one underneath it so that at the tops (top of the mohawk points, front edge of the axe, tip of the spearpoint on the axe, top of the forefingers, knuckles and muscle tops) your colors are all very light compared to the deep creases and those areas in shadow.

Also, on this mini, I see there are still traces of where you didn\'t go back and fix things - it looks like the eyebrow at left bled some paint into the forehead, the brass charm bracelet bled into the silver wrist band, the silver ring bled into the gold one, the flesh on the lower hand bled into the ring, the black between the fingers comes out too high and should instead be closer to a brown. The green on the gems is only one color (no highlights) and bleeds into the gray of the axe, the axe handle isn\'t highlighted.
Heh, I don\'t mean to be harsh so please dont take it that way, I\'m really just trying to help you see how to improve. A mini is the sum of it\'s parts and all the little details should add up to a neat and tidy figure.
So, in summary, really focus on each detail of the mini especially it\'s outline and color seperation. Also be more cognizant of where light falls on a mini and highlight accordingly.

oh yeah - go look at the top 10 minis and really examine how the affects are achieved. Try to copy the style. experiment, practice, take the time . .

Most recently I\'ve been blown away by Cyril and Kuromaru - the latter especially. Look at their stuff in particular.

I hope I\'ve been constructive here so . . . good luck!
 

Martin2D

New member
I just wanted to thank everyone who posted, especially Flashman. My eyes just aren\'t as adept at picking up the stuff you do, but I went back and fixed everything you said there was a problem with. Hopefully I\'ll get another pic up as soon as I\'m SURE I\'m done. I\'ll be entering him in a contest pretty soon. I\'ll let you know how he does, but it will be a while.
 

KingM

New member
Progress is the most important thing to a painter.

If you can look at a recent miniature and an older one, and see improvement, then you are on the right track.

Think of it this way, it is very difficult to get worse at painting, perhaps only by not doing it for a very long time. Thereby, you really can only get better. The more practice you get, the more blends, techniques and models you try. The quicker you will get to the level you want to paint at

keep at it Martin2D, you\'re doing great
 

Jericho

Consummate Brushlicker
I still think one of the biggest mistakes a painter can make is to assume that since they aren\'t getting better by leaps and bounds with every fig that that they won\'t get better at all. Persistence is a big part of painting.

A year ago I thought I had started to peak with my painting, but by simply keeping at it and trying new things every now and again I\'m still getting better. My last 2 submissions have been my two highest rankings, by quite a bit too (8.7 and 8.6).

So yeah, don\'t get discouraged and keep on painting for simply the love of painting. You\'ll continue to get better with time, I\'m sure of it :)
 

InkerMark

New member
White Dwarf articles

What Flashman said about the \'Eavy Metal articles in White Dwarf should not be taken lightly. They\'ve really helped me over the past year in doing much better shading.
I did a minaiture a few weeks ago of Legolas for the National Lord of the Rings painting competition that GW is holding. I\'ve won my state competition with it, and now move on to the regionals.
I know a lot of folks don\'t care for GW, but if someone is looking to improve their painting, those articles can at least help them learn about shading and blending.

Mark- Master of the Inky Finger Clan
 
C

Chronique

Guest
Clear coat

I can tell that you\'re sealing your minis with some kind of clear coat. That\'s a good thing, but you\'re using the wrong stuff. Get yourself a can of Testors Dull Coat. Myself, and most people I know swear by it. Give your mini a once over, just till it\'s a little glisteny, and then wait for it to dry. It really makes the colors leap off the mini, and you won\'t even have to repaint.
 

JonG

New member
Flashman\'s point about brush size is particularly of note. I recently switched to using a smaller brush and it made a real step-change in my results.

Couple of other things I do which may help:

I blu-tac the mini to an unused paint pot so I\'ve got more to hold on to than just the base when I\'m painting.

Also, make sure your painting hand is well supported. For example, I usually rest the wrist/palm of my painting hand against the hand that\'s holding the mini (which in turn is usually braced against my knee). This way I find it easier to make small, steady controlled movements.

Finally, and apologies for stating the obvious, take your time. If you\'re painting a showcase mini then don\'t be afraid to spend ages getting it just right.

- Jon
 
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