UniversalHead
New member
An unsatisfying WoK game - what did I do wrong?
I don't want to be negative about WoK. I've invested quite a bit of money and hundreds of hours into the game and would love it to be my miniatures game of choice. But I keep having somewhat underwhelming games and it's really frustrating!
I'd love to have a sensible discussion and find out if 'it's just us'. Perhaps we're approaching the game incorrectly, or the style of the game doesn't fit our style of play. But something doesn't seem to be clicking. We're experienced miniatures gamers who also play Confrontation, AT-43, Dust Battlefield, Warmachine, and Hell Dorado.
I've raised this issue before, but we're still finding the main issues to be the lack of a charge mechanic, and the motivations system. Let me illustrate. We had a Nasier vs Teknes game. Nasier had Sever the Head and Teknes had Capture Prisoners. Of course, my Teknes opponent's strategy was to retreat before my advance, luring me into his C deployment section, so when he did manage to kill a unit in melee, he had little or no distance to move before scoring 2 morale. I on the other hand had to try and kill his marked leaders and specialists, which he kept lurking behind his main infantry and blocking terrain, far away from my attacks.
On the surface, this sounds like an interesting combination of motivations that would lead to strategic gameplay. In practice, it lead to several turns of frustrating standoff, until I finally got fed up and got more aggressive, and he could kill a few low strength units over in his end of the field, easily hitting me with a 2 morale reduction each time he did so.
The ability to premeasure all distances encourages you to move your troops from your opponent's - say a distance equal to their move distance plus half an inch, just outside of their move range. And there you sit, waiting for someone to crack first. There's no opportunity to charge (if you sprint, they'd attack first when they activate). In this particular case, every time I got close he'd back off a little, drawing me further back into his deployment zone.
Of course, I know there are other units on the board, that the order of activation matters, that I could move a couple of units up and taunt the opponent (I forgot to try that - I must next time) etc. But in general, instead of the rules invisibly working to make the game flow, encouraging an interesting conflict, they seem to be invisibly blocking the flow and causing us frustrations. It's hard to express, but it's something I haven't encountered in other games. Perhaps there should only be particular match-ups of motivations (though it seems Capture Prisoners is always going to be problematic). Perhaps we should just invent in a new action and see what happens - charge (move normally with a 1-4 inch bonus and attack with a hit penalty?)
I've said it before, but even after the motivations revamp, many of them are just too fiddly, with little counters everywhere. We've taken to BluTak-ing counters and wound markers on our units in an attempt to make it manageable.
I write this in the most positive, enquiring spirit I can, as I want to love this game and I want to pick apart how I'm approaching it. There are other issues, but I can deal with them: I find the hit system a bit frustrating and unsatisfying, as I think it is intrinsically more enjoyable to roll the dice knowing what you need to roll to hit, than roll a dice and have your opponent tell you if you hit. I think some of the unit special abilities are too complex and there are too many of them, but that's bearable after I designed a complex sheet writing out all our specific army's attacks and abilities so you can see them at a glance.
I'd love to hear from other players who are having really enjoyable games, and if they find the game system to flow well and be interesting and exciting. Because right at the moment, we're starting to lose a bit of enthusiasm and turn to other games. At the very least, I'm thinking I should repurpose some more traditional fantasy battle scenarios rather than use the motivations (sacrilege!)
Any feedback very welcome! Thanks for reading.
I don't want to be negative about WoK. I've invested quite a bit of money and hundreds of hours into the game and would love it to be my miniatures game of choice. But I keep having somewhat underwhelming games and it's really frustrating!
I'd love to have a sensible discussion and find out if 'it's just us'. Perhaps we're approaching the game incorrectly, or the style of the game doesn't fit our style of play. But something doesn't seem to be clicking. We're experienced miniatures gamers who also play Confrontation, AT-43, Dust Battlefield, Warmachine, and Hell Dorado.
I've raised this issue before, but we're still finding the main issues to be the lack of a charge mechanic, and the motivations system. Let me illustrate. We had a Nasier vs Teknes game. Nasier had Sever the Head and Teknes had Capture Prisoners. Of course, my Teknes opponent's strategy was to retreat before my advance, luring me into his C deployment section, so when he did manage to kill a unit in melee, he had little or no distance to move before scoring 2 morale. I on the other hand had to try and kill his marked leaders and specialists, which he kept lurking behind his main infantry and blocking terrain, far away from my attacks.
On the surface, this sounds like an interesting combination of motivations that would lead to strategic gameplay. In practice, it lead to several turns of frustrating standoff, until I finally got fed up and got more aggressive, and he could kill a few low strength units over in his end of the field, easily hitting me with a 2 morale reduction each time he did so.
The ability to premeasure all distances encourages you to move your troops from your opponent's - say a distance equal to their move distance plus half an inch, just outside of their move range. And there you sit, waiting for someone to crack first. There's no opportunity to charge (if you sprint, they'd attack first when they activate). In this particular case, every time I got close he'd back off a little, drawing me further back into his deployment zone.
Of course, I know there are other units on the board, that the order of activation matters, that I could move a couple of units up and taunt the opponent (I forgot to try that - I must next time) etc. But in general, instead of the rules invisibly working to make the game flow, encouraging an interesting conflict, they seem to be invisibly blocking the flow and causing us frustrations. It's hard to express, but it's something I haven't encountered in other games. Perhaps there should only be particular match-ups of motivations (though it seems Capture Prisoners is always going to be problematic). Perhaps we should just invent in a new action and see what happens - charge (move normally with a 1-4 inch bonus and attack with a hit penalty?)
I've said it before, but even after the motivations revamp, many of them are just too fiddly, with little counters everywhere. We've taken to BluTak-ing counters and wound markers on our units in an attempt to make it manageable.
I write this in the most positive, enquiring spirit I can, as I want to love this game and I want to pick apart how I'm approaching it. There are other issues, but I can deal with them: I find the hit system a bit frustrating and unsatisfying, as I think it is intrinsically more enjoyable to roll the dice knowing what you need to roll to hit, than roll a dice and have your opponent tell you if you hit. I think some of the unit special abilities are too complex and there are too many of them, but that's bearable after I designed a complex sheet writing out all our specific army's attacks and abilities so you can see them at a glance.
I'd love to hear from other players who are having really enjoyable games, and if they find the game system to flow well and be interesting and exciting. Because right at the moment, we're starting to lose a bit of enthusiasm and turn to other games. At the very least, I'm thinking I should repurpose some more traditional fantasy battle scenarios rather than use the motivations (sacrilege!)
Any feedback very welcome! Thanks for reading.
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