Green stuff vs brown/white stuff

[zynmpth]

hello, I was just looking at some minis by Allan C, and noticed that he used mostly what i asumed to be white stuff. This lead me to wondering what is the differance is between green stuff /white stuff /brownstuff. Thanks for any advice

 

[Ritual]

The white clay that Allan (and many others) are using is some clay that\'s cheaper than green and brown stuff (there are several alternatives there), but still useful on basic shapes and such. Brown stuff is harder than green stuff and is often used for fine detail and sharp edges and such. It is more expensive and therefore often used only when necessary.

Maybe someone who knows more about sculpting can give you further information on the subject!

 

[Brokenblade]

Yeh ritual pretty much summed it up, i think Allan C uses Fimo, a modelling clay which cures when baked in the over, white stuff is aparently not as good to use as greenstuff and was released as an alternative to greenstuff in some places (because greenstuff was apparently toxic or something) however i\'ve never used whitestuff so can\'t comment on how easy it is to work with.

 

[Prophet]

Green is the standard. Green and brown are fairly similar when wet. Green is a little stickier and brown has a litle less memory, but essentially the same. Differences is when they are cured. Green is still rubbery when fully cured. It\'s that flexibility that makes it so mold-friendly. Brown dries harder. No give to it, but it takes filing, sanding, carving much better than green. Good for doing things that need hard sharp edges like armor and weapons.
White stuff was garbage. Extremely limited working time because the putty would soon develop a skin that kept it from sticking or taking detail. And cost about 3x as much as green. I don\'t think it is still being manufactured.
BTW, none of them are toxic, but they can be skin irritants to some people.

What Alan uses is fimo. Fimo is a polymer clay. Doesn\'t harden until baked. Advantage is virtually unlimited working time. Disadvantage is that it is extremely brittle after baking and has to be cast by RTV or more expensive lower temp and pressure silicone molds. Bottom line is it\'s more expensive to cast, so most US manufacturers shy away. More common among European sculptors.

 

[zynmpth]

thanks for the reply, i was just wondering if there are any other advantages/differences to fimo, over gs other then its unlimited working time. I was also wondering if there is a specific way to \"cure (ie what temerature should i bake it at ect) or work with fimo. Or a specific type of fimo that works best for that matter. (sorry for all the questions, but i am a complete newbie on the matter)

 

[Dragonsreach]

Originally posted by zynmpth
thanks for the reply, i was just wondering if there are any other advantages/differences to fimo, over gs other then its unlimited working time.
I have limited experience working with Fimo but it does blend two sections together easier than Green Stuff. It\'s consistency feels a little like uncooked bacon rind and is slightly greasy to the touch. It does require patience while handling it as I did get fingeprints everywhere first attempt. It\'s easier to work with wet tools and I would recommend trying to find rubber shaper tools for some of the basic shapes. Other tools you\'ll find handy are Darning Needles and Cut-down knitting needles (thin) for shaping

I was also wondering if there is a specific way to \"cure (ie what temerature should i bake it at ect) or work with fimo.
The standard temperature recommended by Fimo themselves is 130 for 30 minutes

Or a specific type of fimo that works best for that matter.
Most people that I have seen use either the White or Champagne as these are just colours which make it easier to see what you are doing.

(sorry for all the questions, but i am a complete newbie on the matter)
Hey don\'t be sorry, that\'s what this section of the forums is all about.

One book which is absolutley great for a person who is interested in beginning sculpting is :
\"Creating Life-Like Figures in Polymer Clay\" by Katherine Dewey

You should be able to find a couple of her books on Amazon.

 

[freakinacage]

it says on the packet of fimo what temp. you can do it ina normal oven( gas mark 5 i think) i don\'t think there are different types of fimo - just different colours. i\'ve only used it a couple of times before but use a mid tone grey as it\'s easier to see. as previously mentioned, fimo is a lot cheaper. it also depends what you like. fimo is a clay and works as such whereas gs is more rubbery and \'remembers\' it\'s shape. gs is better for organic shapes if you ask me.

 

[QuietiManes]

There are different types of Fimo. You want to stay away from the soft ones, same for Sculpey. They\'re weaker when cured and just too soft when pliable (you get your fingerprints in them with the slightest touch as mentioned).

 

[Molebrain]

Tamiya makes a white sculpting putty that is similar to brown stuff, though maybe a bit more rubbery. It also dries hard enough to file. I used it a bit on a few of my last pieces and it works fine.

Zach
www.crookedeye.net

 

[minimaker]

I saw some miniatures made by Stefan of Masquerade miniatures done in Tamiya putty. It works well for him. I got a packet from him but have yet to try.

As to Fimo colours, it does actually matter what colour you choose. Some differ a fair bit in properties from eachother. Here is a bit from the 1listsculpting FAQ.

(I included a bit on how it is sometimes used in combination with epoxy putties)
********
Polymer clays and epoxy putties can be used together. They can each be used for the part of the sculpt they are most suited for, but can also be mixed to get different properties. Some masters, like several by Rackham, are made primarily using Polymer clays --on which, details are added in epoxy putties. A common combination is:
- Fimo Soft or a mix made of FIMO Classic and FIMO Soft. Not all colors have the same properties and a favorite color is Champagne. Other colors mentioned are Flesh, Light Grey, and Green. The FIMO is used for general sculpting.
- Kneadatite blue-yellow to add fine details (it\'s a lot stickier).
- Milliput/ A& B or another hard putty for making mechanical parts (like weapons).

When using a combination like this, one does have to take care when baking the sculpt (like polymer clay). Cyril mentioned on another list that Andrea Sculpt and Milliput can take 150 degrees Centigrade OK with some browning, but that Kneadatite blue-yellow can let go at those temperatures. Longer baking at a lower temperature (not more than 120 degrees centigrade) is recommended. Do note that normal baking temperature is 130 degrees centigrade.
*****

Bye, Ming-Hua

 

[zynmpth]

Thanks for the replies every one, however I do have one more question, how will rebaking affect it. I ask this, because I assume that like gs fimo, you should work in layers,( letting one layer dry before applying the next layer, so you don\'t mess up the detail). or do you have to do all the work in one go, and add gs for the finishing touches. thanks again for all the help

 

[Medved]

baking in layers has one draw back. fimo does not stick to cured fimo very well. this is possible to get around by half-baking the fimo/sculpey. the fimo will go more solid and start to get memory, but can still be worked into and more putty stuck onto. if you are working on minis that are not to be cast up then it is perfectly fine to bulk up in fimo/whatever polymer clay.......bake it and then finish in green stuff. i find green stuff holds detail like no other putty, you just have to get the hang of it.

if you are looking for castable minis then use the green stuff on its own

 

[zynmpth]

thanks, although, I\'m still not quite clear on one thing, is it possible to bake fimo several times I understand that it may be difficult to get the fresh fimo to stick to cured fimo, just wondering if you can bake it twice. thanks again for helping me.

 

[Prophet]

Yes. Fimo can be rebaked.

 

[freakinacage]

thank god for that because i have baked a bust that i have started (and wanted to \'save\' what i had done so i couln\'t put any massive finger prints on it). only then did i think - can you re bake it? cheers

 

[zynmpth]

thank you so much for all the help every one

 

[Itchy]

i\'m not sure about Fimo, but i know you can only rebake polymer clay so many times before it wants to start cracking apart on you. Have had that happen to me before.