Getting Started...again

[Mordac85]

After ~20yr break, I\'m looking to start painting mini\'s again. I used to use enamels on Grenadier lead minis and still have some that will be revived soon. I\'m still working on reading the tutorials before I start buying any materials and I have a few questions that maybe you could help me with.

I\'ve never used acrylics before and had a simple question that I haven\'t seen in the tuts. There are references to palettes for mixing and I\'m assuming a general one from an art store would suffice, but besides mixing custom colors, what can I use it for?

Also, I\'m still trying to figure out what inking is. Is this an altogether different type of paint or just a different application method?

I\'ve got washes, highlighting and wet blending down from my previous experience (at least I hope I can still remember it). I just need to get back into it to hone my rusty skills. The new medium will be a challenge but I like the fact there is a place like this that I can pose questions and also get some great inspiration!

TIA

 

[Spacemunkie]

Hello!!

I didn\'t do any mini painting for nearly ten years, and it was great to get back into it. This place certainly feeds my addiction now....

It is generally agreed that thinning acrylic paint is the way to go before applying it - so you\'ll need a palette even without mixing colours.

Acrylic inks can be used in a similar way to washes, but are far more intense. They can be used to thin paint whilst retaining or intensifying depth of colour. They also work well for glazing. They tend to dry with a slightly glossy sheen.

Wet blending is a right bugger with acrylics even when drying retarder is used, and frankly I find it totally unecessary.

 

[Mordac85]

Thanks, I\'m hoping this will be an enjoyable hobby that will fit a busy schedule.

I think I understand inks now and will stick w/getting proficient w/the basics first. Is there any rule of thumb on how dilute to make the paint or a wash? Or maybe an article I haven\'t found yet that covers this?

 

[mczolton]

I am also getting back into minis after eight years. I have to admit, seeing some of the work on this forum is a bit intimidating, but I plan on sticking with it and hopefully my skills (if I had any *grin*) will return.

Mark

 

[Klute]

\" I have to admit, seeing some of the work on this forum is a bit intimidating\"


Believe me it is for everyone. The difference being we all like to share our knowledgewith each other.

When thinning acrylic paint I always use a drop of flow enhancer too, well nearly always. Winsor and Newton acrylic flow enhancer.

 

[EricJ]

Originally posted by Mordac85
Thanks, I\'m hoping this will be an enjoyable hobby that will fit a busy schedule.

I think I understand inks now and will stick w/getting proficient w/the basics first. Is there any rule of thumb on how dilute to make the paint or a wash? Or maybe an article I haven\'t found yet that covers this?

I think this is a great hobby for a busy schedule, I tend to work about 60-75 hours a week, dealing with a new house, and trying to maintain a scrap of social life, and painting still fits in.

As for thinning paint, there is a TON of opinions on this, but honestly, water does the trick for me, and I\'d suggest just trying to start there as a base, then if you want to try other products to adjust how this works, you have a base to go back to.

And yes, I think that this place will always produce intimidating paint jobs. Daily I run across stuff that intimidates me, but these pieces always serve as great learning tools and motivation at long as they don\'t paralize your efforts!

 

[Spacemunkie]

Had to stop using that Mark. It made me gag every time I licked my brush! :|~

The consistency of diluted paint many people use is often described as being milky. Pretty liquid so your layers dry semi-transparent.

 

[Einion]

Originally posted by EricJ
As for thinning paint, there is a TON of opinions on this, but honestly, water does the trick for me, and I\'d suggest just trying to start there as a base...

Couldn\'t agree more, start with water and give it a good run (at least a few months) and then try an additive or two if you need it.

Einion

 

[Mordac85]

Thanks so much for the variety of information for a returning newbie.

Originally posted by Spacemunkie
The consistency of diluted paint many people use is often described as being milky. Pretty liquid so your layers dry semi-transparent.

So if the paint should be diluted to a semi transparent layer, how much does that differ from a wash? I understand there are various opinions and there are no exact limits, however, does say, a 4:1 ratio for a \'normal\' layer and maybe an 8 or 10:1 for a wash sound right?

Which brings up an interesting idea. If I start off and really screw it up will washing it in normal water be a way to drop back to square one? I know I\'m gonna hose the first one, but I\'d like to know how to recover when I do.

I\'m starting to get obsessed about starting because I see where this can give me the control and layering I could never achieve w/enamels. Time and patience will be key but not a problem. Now I just need to get to the art store on top of the Christmas shopping.
:flip:

 

[DrEvilmonki]

Hey I have not heard of people using inks as a thinner. Thanks Spacemunkie. I love this site - always learning new stuff to try!

 

[Modderrhu]

Originally posted by Mordac85
So if the paint should be diluted to a semi transparent layer, how much does that differ from a wash? I understand there are various opinions and there are no exact limits, however, does say, a 4:1 ratio for a \'normal\' layer and maybe an 8 or 10:1 for a wash sound right?

There you are, getting the hang of it already. 4:1 might be a bit thin for a \'normal\' solid layer, 2:1 or even 1:1 will give you better coverage to start working with. That\'s one of the problems of working with acrylics - coverage. Some paints, particularly red and yellow, don\'t cover up the colours beneath them very well. There are techniques to get around this, but that\'s a matter for another thread. 10:1 is a reasonable wash, but I often go even thinner, 15:1 for when I\'m in doubt as to how strong I want the wash to be. For techniques like glazing, which is done instead of wet-blending, a \'typical\' ratio is 6:1 or 8:1

Originally posted by Mordac85
Which brings up an interesting idea. If I start off and really screw it up will washing it in normal water be a way to drop back to square one? I know I\'m gonna hose the first one, but I\'d like to know how to recover when I do.

Nope, sorry! Acrylics might be water soluble when wet, but once dry, they form a solid layer of plastic. There are numerous threads on how to strip acrylics, and you\'ll see that simple water just won\'t do it. Often, you won\'t have to strip paint at all, if your layers have been thin enough and no detail has been obscured.

Originally posted by Mordac85
I\'m starting to get obsessed about starting because I see where this can give me the control and layering I could never achieve w/enamels.

Aye, acrylics are an absolute joy to work with when compared to enamels. No foul smelling and headache inducing thinners or cleaning media. Note that drybrushing is something that does not carry over very well from enamels - it can look absolutely terrible when done with acrylics.

As for additives, agreed with the previous posts. See how water works for you before you play around. Different additives for different people. Flow aid will make the paint flow more smoothly without pooling, and wash or acrylic media, like the fabled Future Floor Wax will tend to make the paint gather. It\'s useful to know what these things do, so that you know what to try if water alone isn\'t enough.

Have you looked through CMON\'s >>articles<< yet? There are heaps of excellent articles on techniques that can be used with acrylics.

And welcome.

 

[Mordac85]

Yeah I think I\'ll keep w/water for now and move into other additives if I need to later. Future floor wax tho? It makes a wierd kind of sense, but seems like an odd source. Is there nothing that you guys won\'t try?

Actually, I have been through a number of the articles already and love some of the details and ideas presented. It\'s one of the reasons I finally decided to give it another try. That\'s why I wanted to confirm my \'guesstimate\' of ratios from what I\'ve been reading.

Too bad I forgot about the underlying content of acrylic paint. Guess I\'ll have to start on pieces I won\'t mind trashing. Removing the paint after it\'s dried probably wouldn\'t be worth it to me at this stage.

Thanks for all the helpful advice!

 

[Ritual]

When it comes to thinning your paint you\'ll have to try out what you like best to work with. Different people have different preferrences.

 

[Valander]

Originally posted by Ritual
When it comes to thinning your paint you\'ll have to try out what you like best to work with. Different people have different preferrences.

What he said.

Welcome back to the hobby! One thing I\'d like to add about the thinning ratio question is that it will also depend quite a bit on your chosen brand of paint. Some (like Vallejo Model Color) take a higher wateraint ratio than others (like Citadel or Reaper Pro).

Of course, that\'s probably going to start the whole \"which paint is better\" argument, but there it is.

I think the main thing you need to do is play with a few different paints, techniques, etc., so that you can get a feel for how they handle and determine what works best for what you want to do. Contrary to some of the opinions that might be expressed around here, there is no one \"true way.\"

 

[mczolton]

Note that drybrushing is something that does not carry over very well from enamels - it can look absolutely terrible when done with acrylics.

Speaking of drybrushing and thinning paint, does anyone have a recommendation on water to paint ratio? I\'ve tried a 1:1 with GW paints and it seems a little thin. Sometimes it appears thin enough that even a drybrush gets into small areas that I don\'t intend it to.

Sorry, I don\'t mean to usurp the thread.

Mark

 

[Modderrhu]

Well, for drybrushing, I never thin the paint. When there\'s so little paint on the brush that it barely leaves a mark on my hand, that is when it\'s right for drybrushing. Thinning the paint would make it completely ineffective the way I do it.

Perhaps you means overbrushing, which is done with very, very light strokes of a wetter brush? I\'d treat that like normal painting, except with very little paint on the brush.

 

[mczolton]

Modderrhu,

Thanks for the tip. I\'m sure many of us newbies or those returning to the hobby will benefit from your advice.

Mark